Comments on A Spiritual Diablog: A Divine Plan or a Divine Run? Post #2

Shyloh: I wonder how many people are constitutiona...

2005-10-10T15:04:00.000-04:00

Shyloh: I wonder how many people are constitutionally non joggers, and how many just have that stupid experience of being forced to run around the footfield once a year in gym class to go by...

After I jogged for long enough, and learned to recognize my own pace and breathing rhythm, it was as comfortable and relaxing as - lying down!

I have been into fitness seems forever. I am just not the physical type ha. Sounds lazy but I really am not. I have my own gym (just all the things one needs. Plus I swim every summer in my pool which helps. and then I go to the club once a week just for fun. I know what you are saying. It really doesn't take that long to get into it if one really applies themself. It is so refreshing and and one feels and sleeps so much better. Thenb eating habits changs. Well they did for me.

A, glad you can see and feel it. I think I did get...

2005-10-10T08:55:00.000-04:00

A, glad you can see and feel it. I think I did get a lot of the details of the experience in there. It was written years ago, and very likely right after "wind running." I can definitely recall seeing a specific kid pedaling his bike past me without being able to hear it...

Twh: I actually jogged for two years before I started liking it. Before that it was just for the exercise. Yes, a lot of people get a lot out of walking. William Wordsworth, my favorite poet, for example. (He wrote that goofy thing about the daffodils and wandering lonely as a cloud that's in all the anthologies - I guess because it's so accessible. But he wrote some really good stuff too.)

Hi Mona, welcome back. To me, feeling it, living it - that's what's most important. I also find that understanding what you can is helpful. I liked Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance too, especially his discussion of the concept of quality.

Shyloh: I wonder how many people are constitutionally non joggers, and how many just have that stupid experience of being forced to run around the footfield once a year in gym class to go by...

After I jogged for long enough, and learned to recognize my own pace and breathing rhythm, it was as comfortable and relaxing as - lying down!

^|||ooops the anonymous is me shyloh. Sorry I thou...

2005-10-09T20:55:00.000-04:00

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ooops the anonymous is me shyloh. Sorry I thought I was logged in.

Hello Paul. This was excellent.After I earned my b...

2005-10-09T20:49:00.000-04:00

Hello Paul. This was excellent.

After I earned my black belt in Martial Arts I sort of got bored with it. Then I got in to Pilates Yoga. I am the type of person that really doesn't like anything physical. So this suited me just fine. Anytime I can lay down and workout it's for me and soooooooo cool haha.

Later you.

Hi Paul, It's been awhile since I've been visiting...

2005-10-09T20:23:00.000-04:00

Hi Paul,
It's been awhile since I've been visiting. I really like this post...it's so eloquent. And I especially appreciate that you are careful of when to use "it's" and "its."

As I was reading, it felt a lot like a "Zen and the Art of Running" sort of thing.

At the end, I love your possible thoughts on God wanting a running partner...and then the rich discussion that comes up in the comments. I really do enjoy pondering on the role of God and the role of us and how we envision God. It seems so complex (and then again, sometimes feels so simple) and difficult to articulate at times, but it's also something that we can just f-e-e-l.

Thanks for the great post, Paul.

even walking can produce the same effect if one pa...

2005-10-09T14:10:00.000-04:00

even walking can produce the same effect if one pays little attention to the distractions of the mechanincal life around them and listens only to the trees and the wind.

i envy you your running. it's not something i wish to take up, though. i've always said that i would run only if some mad man were chasing me or my child.

cool runnings....teresa

Yes, it is an amazing feeling. Strong descriptions...

2005-10-09T13:32:00.000-04:00

Yes, it is an amazing feeling. Strong descriptions here. I can see and feel the breeze.

Hi Barbara, thanks. Wish everyone could find some ...

2005-10-09T13:27:00.000-04:00

Hi Barbara, thanks. Wish everyone could find some activity that was as well suited to them mentally and physically as jogging was for me. I said "Wind Runner" because, let's face it, that's sexier than "Wind Jogger..." But it was definitely jogging...

What a beautiful way to begin a Sunday morning, re...

2005-10-09T11:41:00.000-04:00

What a beautiful way to begin a Sunday morning, reading these words here.

You write so well, and seem to be so connected to your insides and the sounds around you.

Thanks, Kerry. To me, when I've felt myself to be ...

2005-10-09T09:17:00.000-04:00

Thanks, Kerry. To me, when I've felt myself to be moving along my life's path in a way that was something more than my way alone, it's contained elements of both passiveness and activity. A major part of the activity was developing a way of life that included things in my routine that brought me closer to what might be called a sense of God's presence. When I was healthy, jogging, usually at dawn or shortly after sunrise, was an important part of that.

Hi Mau - Any thoughts on what the plan consists of?

For me, peace came with just plunging into the process of living after learning a few things about myself and our relation to God that were enough for me to know. So in my own experience, I know little, believe less, but what little I know is enough to get me through.

i found a lot of peace in understanding the divine...

2005-10-09T01:22:00.000-04:00

i found a lot of peace in understanding the divine plan

outstanding writing paul. your thoughts move my mi...

2005-10-08T22:34:00.000-04:00

outstanding writing paul. your thoughts move my mind to rethink the direction of my plan. and i always seem to have one..*sighs* perhaps it is truly time for me to just let go and run along side in silence. i have so much to learn still...

Hi Crystal, maybe that depends what circles you tr...

2005-10-08T21:02:00.000-04:00

Hi Crystal, maybe that depends what circles you travel in. I get the impression more people incline your way - toward God as person.

But I guess it's ultimately up to him (her?), ha ha...

As far as my own sense of a depersonalized God goes: First, there ought to be a better term than either that or - "impersonal." You get a picture of a faceless Entity wearing a white lab coat, like a sort of Doctor who meets with you in a sterile examiation room after you've been kept waiting 2 hours and it ends up being a let down, but maybe that's just me personalizing the impersonal.

Ok, I'm rambling in case no one's noticed... Where I was starting to go with this is that my own feeling for it isn't that God is a part of me that I can access, but that I can partially and very imperfectly access part of God - that there's an interface, or maybe intra or introface; a place or space in me where I personally experience my connection to God. A bit of the Godliness is in us, so to speak - that's the sense.

Hi Paul - nice piece of writing :-).I think, from...

2005-10-08T20:21:00.000-04:00

Hi Paul - nice piece of writing :-).

I think, from reading this and the stuff at Larry's and the scripture study blog, that most people see god as depersonalized ... a part of themselves that they can access. I'm in the minority, I guess ... I don't think god has a plan for everything, but I do want him to be a person.

Asiansmiles: I think you hit the nail on the head....

2005-10-08T14:53:00.000-04:00

Asiansmiles: I think you hit the nail on the head. A lot of this comes down to what we mean by the word God.

"Yahweh" is the ancient Hebrew word for God meaning, ineffable, or "beyond words."

And the more words we use about God, the more detailed our beliefs and explanations, the more we seem to find to disagree about.

Hello Paul,"We are the ones with divine plans and ...

2005-10-08T14:08:00.000-04:00

Hello Paul,

"We are the ones with divine plans and preconceived notions."

I agree, 100%. I guess it all boils down to our concept of God. Is He the God that literally created the world? Does He dwell in us? Is He somewhere or in a place called 'heaven' and looks down on us? Does He really intervene? Listen to our pleas? What about nature? Does He really prevent or allow disasters? Someone in a forum said that God is within the framework of nature too. Or is He an absentee God (created us then left us to our own devices)? etc. etc. Such questions lead to a single question, "who" is God to us?
And the more we dig into doctrines, sacred books, etc. etc., the more we see the differences, and hence the confusion.

Some people would always attack the believers of God because of such confusions. But then again, we could always lose the battle on apologetics, we could always get confused with the interpretations and doctrines, but that's about it.

The confusion is created by us, in our minds.

Whatever happens to our beliefs, God - in His divine existence - remains untouched and unchanged.

"God's wisdom is not ours".
I believe that too.

Thanks and God bless.

Bonita, thanks. And you raise questions like, What...

2005-10-08T10:50:00.000-04:00

Bonita, thanks. And you raise questions like, What is the divine will? How do we recognize it? Is it something that exists completely apart from us, so that we find it only in, say, opening the Bible at random and putting our fingers on a verse to answer a question - and then figure it wasn't really random? Or asking an external authority, like a priest, who we have been taught and believe has a special connection to God that we lack?

Or does it involve learning to discern one's personal and "rebellious" will from a will greater than our own, that we can nevertheless experience? Viewed in this manner, externals like the Bible or a priest can be helpful guides, but we're not let off the hook when it comes to spiritual discernment...

Okay, that was a loaded question...

La Coloratura, thank you. Me too - that is, I can't run anymore either.

Kathy, I appreciate it.

awesome! love it!

2005-10-07T21:24:00.000-04:00

awesome! love it!

This is beautiful... I think God is looking for a ...

2005-10-07T21:09:00.000-04:00

This is beautiful... I think God is looking for a running partner, well said!

I can't run much because it usually causes my chronic back pain to flare up... but I love it and this reminded me of that... but it's applicable to anything we give in to with all our body and soul and allow ourselves to enjoy.

A lovely post!

WOW, so beautifully written. But, the metaphor tha...

2005-10-07T20:46:00.000-04:00

WOW, so beautifully written. But, the metaphor that works for me is where we try to just put ourselves into the 'flow' of life, submit to the changes and chances, always striving to live our lives according to the divine Will. Of course, exertion is so necessary, like you indicate, ever mindful of every nuance, every milestone. Sometimes, it is slow going, sometimes a strong gust will blow us away for awhile.